Re: Mail List Format -- non ST content (was Re: Bagster Tank Bags)

["Mike Bostock" <mike@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

In your message regarding Mail List Format -- non ST content (was Re:
Bagster Tank Bags) dated Fri, 5 Jan 2001 18:44:49 -0800, Neil Lindsey said
that ...

>NL-  From: "Mike Bostock" <mike@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>  
>  
> > Don't get too paranoid, it's a common affliction for M$ Outlook (Express
> > users).  For those that insist on using M$OE help can be found here
> > http://www.unicorn-k9.fsnet.co.uk/outlook.html
> >
>NL-  
>NL-  My original request applied mostly to the inclusion of all the text of all
>NL-  previous messages in any given reply, which of course gets worse as the
>NL-  thread progesses, but the information that you point to is useful
>NL-  nonetheless.

This is due to the 'reply' format of M$OE where the uninitiated
automatically start writing *above* the post to which they are replying. 
This seems to be standard and preferred in the corporate world where they
like to have the entire 'thread' in one message but obviously isn't
applicable to mailing lists where you can just scroll up (or down,
depending on your sort order) the list to see what Fred said.  Writing
'between the lines', so to speak, also makes it easier to make sense of
the discussion.  The former 'corporate method' also obeys the M$
philosophy of "why send 1 byte down the network when you can send 1000"
:-( 

So in this respect, you and I agree :-)

>NL-  However the configuration changes to OE that are suggested effectively
>NL-  cripple OE to use Plain Text *all* the time, which may not be to the liking
>NL-  of all users.  

In this respect, we disagree.  If you set your default state in M$OE to
'Plain Text' it is *very* easy to revert to HTML (Menu bar Format|HTML). 
This step is available also when replying.

>NL-  The T5 List just got done with a heated discussion about
>NL-  whether HTML is a good thing to use in e-mail or not, so I don't want to
>NL-  start that again here, except to suggest that HTML has it's place,

Can't for the life of me think where that place is but if you want to
impress your friends with your text formatting skills in an email message
and have fancy coloured backgrounds then fine.  However, this disregards
the fact that you have increased the message size about 5-fold.

>NL-  just not
>NL-  for e-mail lists since it wreaks havoc with the digests. 

It is a shortcoming with the Majordomo list server that it doesn't strip
out HTML automatically - mind you I don't agree with digests either since
people tend then to have the digest header as the subject of their reply
which is, of course, totally meaningless :-(

>NL-  But the website
>NL-  notes don't mention that if you set the default mode to Plain Text, you
>NL-  should also ensure that the 'Reply to messages using the format in which
>NL-  they were sent' option is unchecked (ie. turned off).  If this option is
>NL-  left enabled, then you'll respond to HTML-formatted posts with HTML
>NL-  regardless.

Thank you for pointing that out to me - I will amend it shortly (it does,
however, show this option deselected in the picture).
  
<snipped>

>NL-  For those rare occasions
>NL-  when you reply *and* don't notice this problem, I think this is acceptable
>NL-  (and forgiveable I hope).  If you disagree, then set your default send mode
>NL-  to Plain Text and be done with it, but just be sure to also disable the
>NL-  option to reply using the same format that was sent.

I am sure this is the easier way for the novice.  I have used email now
for 8 years, from the days when you couldn't even use 8 bit characters. 
Apart from the odd occasion when I wanted to send a message with a puce
background for a laugh I have never ever seen the point of HTML, plain
text seems to me to be *quite* adequate for conveying a message.

And as someone has pointed out later in this list, HTML and in particular
M$OE has been the instrument of the propagation of some very nasty worms
and virii due to the backdoors and security blunders associated with M$
code.

Plain text is:

Readable by any email client
Uses less 'bandwidth'
Is safe
Conveys the messaage
Cannot contain 'online' HTML references which try to force your computer
to connect to a remote site
Uses less storage space on your hard-drive



- -- 
Mike Bostock
http://www.toothfairy.co.uk/

'99 Red ST

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