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Re: ramblings(Re: [ST] fjr, again)
- Subject: Re: ramblings(Re: [ST] fjr, again)
- From: Tom Emberson <ate_st@xxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 00:10:14 -0600 (CST)
On Tue, 18 Feb 2003, Brian D . wrote:
> Correct me if I'm wrong, but your main complaint about the ST
> seems to be the handling, specifically front suspension? You
> can upgrade the suspender relatively easily. They sell the bike
> to a target market, and I would guess the demand for race-ready
> handling is not there.
Not asking for race ready, hell the Daytona is not race ready.
It just happens to handle rough pavement better, gives a more
comfortable ride and can perform better in the twisties, and is
warranteed by Triumph for 2 years, or 40-50 k miles for a lot of
people :-)
> I still think the ST has the best FI on the market and a great
> engine and good ergos for most people. The looks are maybe not
> fresh and new, but it's a good looking bike and has better
> factory luggage options than many bikes out there. I wish T.
> would revamp it and sell more just because I'd like them to do
> well and I'd like to see more Sprints out there, but I can see
> where they're coming from.
Yup, completely agree, I never said the bike was junk. There are
two simple things that would have got me to pay the same if not
more for the ST, suspension and engine.
> Technically, the VFR is their flagship (SSS, FI, vtec, all the
> new goodies as they come out). The CBR600RR really made an
> entrance, though, with all those goodies from the GP bike.
>
> H*nda has a MUCH bigger research budget than T., but you're
> right, they've revamped a lot the last 2 years. However, before
> that, the ST1100-come-ST1300 went essentially unchanged for how
> many years? Ditto the VFR from 94(or even 1990)-97. I don't
> think Goldwinnebagos changed much except from the
> 1200->1500->1800. I think that at this point in time, Honda has
> done a lot of redesigning, but in the past they've also known
> to leave well enough alone.
1800 Goldthing was a complete redesign. You are right, some of
the models where getting long in the tooth they where use
dentures, but I guess the point is, Honda looked at the
competition and said, sh*te, we got to get going to compete or
we are going to loose market share, and they did. I personally
do not like the ST1300 or the VFR, but there are some that will
give there left *** for one. I think the 954 is a sexy bike, and
I would drool over a V5 street bike if they go there.
> Yes, that's true, but Joe Consumer won't see it that way. Many
> people compare hp specs and price and go on that. They would
> look like "the same bike".
Maybe I give Joe rider a bit more credit, but I think a lot of
riders do pay attention to a lot more than HP. But then again,
talked to a rider on a Suzuki RF last night, and he had no idea
how many cylinders it had :-)
> Both these are pretty much guesses, based on your or my limited
> experiences with local dealers in 1 market.
Yup
> Essentially, but on a larger scale, isn't this what they do
> with the 02 ST engine?
But they need more, the '02 engine was more to just stop
producing the old engine.
> It seems to me Triumph should concentrate on doing a few things
> and doing them well, rather than trying to have as full a
> lineup as a Japanese manufacturer. I can see the need to
> introduce new bikes and generate interest, but it seems they
> already have enough problems with parts and support work. Won't
> more models make that worse? (I know they try to make the bikes
> modular, but still.)
>
> For example, I think they should just have canned the TT600 and
> replaced it with the Daytona600.
>
> What also should be scary for Triumph is that they used to have
> a unique advantage on some bikes, like the Speed Triple and the
> Tiger, but probably didn't milk that for all it was worth. Now
> there are waves of new naked bikes and adventure tourers
> hitting US shores. Maybe that's why they're trying to keep
> things fresh with new models, but it seems like Triumph should
> also say, "hey, you want an adventure tourer? We've been doing
> that for years!" "You want a naked wheelie monster? we invented
> that niche!"
right on brother!
> That's all really moot, however, if Triumph keeps losing
> dealers and doesn't fix their customer support.
sadly true!
Tom
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