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RE: Motorcycle specific oils
- Subject: RE: Motorcycle specific oils
- From: "Retherford, Martin" <MRetherford@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Tue, 22 Jun 1999 11:00:11 -0700
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Martin,
Excellent post! I hope this dispels the idea that you have to
purchase $48 oil for your ride. You will get the same effect at $24, if I
remember correctly, that you would at $48. For those folks who don't like
to get ripped off.
Martin Retherford
-----Original Message-----
From: mfay@xxxxxxxxxx [mailto:mfay@xxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Monday, June 21, 1999 5:49 AM
To: st@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Motorcycle specific oils
The following was posted on the VTR list and I thought
you guys might
be interested.
Martin
From: Jeff Strickling <jeff@xxxxxxxxxxx> To:
<superhawk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 1999 7:47 PM Subject:
Motorcycle Specific Oils
(Longish)
Over the past few weeks some of the listers have
participated in a
discussion on the use of Motorcycle Specific oil's VS
Automotive Motor
Oil's and Synthetics VS Petroleum based oil's.
Many of you have shared your opinion on this subject
along with your
experiences, and I have shared my professional and
personal opinions
on this subject.
Now comes the hard part my opinion has been swayed by
the testing data
my engineers and market research staff has compiled.
As many of you know my company manufactures lubricants
and we have
been developing a line of motorcycle lubricants. Today
we had a
meeting to discuss the data we have compiled and what
direction we
will be taking on this product line.
Our Petrochemical engineers have done a series of tests
on Automotive
and Motorcycle oils that are available to the consumer
along with
testing our Automotive oils. Both Petroleum and
Synthetic base oils
were tested. Our testing supported the findings of
Dr.John C. Woolum.
The oils tested were all SAE 10W30, 10W40, 15W40 and
20W50 API SJ,
SF/SG and SG/SH (We can not divulge the brands until
the respective
companies are provided
a copy of the test results)
The first set of tests were done in our lab. These
tests were Infrared
Analysis and Atomic Absorption. These tests where
conducted to
alkalize API formulations and additive packages.
The second set of test were application tests. We used
5 different
motorcycles and measured Viscosity, Wear Metals and
Load Performance.
The Bikes.
1992 GSX1100G
1995 GL1500
1994 F3
1997 VTR1000F
1995 Virago 750
Automotive VS Motorcycle specific (Petroleum and
Synthetic)
What few Automotive oils that we found of the API
Services of SF,
SF/SG and SG/SH they preformed as well and there was no
surmountable
difference to justify the expense of reformulating our
current
products.(Or the personal expense)
The Automotive oils of SAE 10W30, 10W40, 15W40 and
20W50 API SJ
(Energy Conserving) did not fare as well. 4 of the 5
motorcycles
displayed the following problems.
Clutch Slippage 10W30, 10W40 and 15W40.
Starter Engagement 10W30, 10W40, 15W40 and 20W50
Conclusion: Any API service of SF, SF/SG, SG/SH and
non-energy
conserving SJ will lubricate your motorcycle without
any negative
consequence.
Synthetics VS Petroleum.
I will not get into this one in great detail. We did
find that
Synthetics are vastly superior to their Petroleum
counterparts. The
Automotive Synthetics that we found of the API service
of SG worked as
well as the Motorcycle Specific Oils.
One note on the synthetics, my engineers stated that
the Mobil 1 MX4T,
V-Twin and Bel-Ray EXS had the best additives package
and they
performed the best.
Marketing.
We polled more than 400 Auto parts Stores in 4 major
U.S. markets and
found that less than 4% carried Motorcycle specific
oil's and less
than 2% carried Automotive oils other than SJ energy
conserving.
This is not surprising first there are only around 3
million
registered Motorcycles in the United States VS 25
million plus
Automobiles and Light Duty Trucks.
The Major Oil Companies really only want to market to
the largest
market segment, this also makes sense in regards to
manufacturing. So
you have a smaller market that is demanding what in
essence is a
specialty product. Therefore they can demand a premium
price knowing
your only alternative is the SJ oils on the shelf at
the local auto
parts store.
When you consider the Motorcycling consumer is actually
paying more
for a lower tech product than they do for their car,
you can
understand why they feel they are being ripped off. Now
the
manufactures will try to justify it
as supply and demand but the reality is these product
in their base
form
are less expensive to manufacture.
At a later date I will make available off list or
through my web site
our
test data.
I will also keep you all informed on the release date
for our
Motorcycle Specific/Automotive Oils. I will tell you
they will not be
reformulated and we are only going change our
packaging.
Jeff Strickling
Vice President Sales and Marketing.
The IQA Lube Corporation.
Houston Texas.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * * *
The ST Mailing list is sponsored by the Unofficial ST
Website
http://www.TriumphNet.com/st for ST and Mailing List info
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<TITLE>RE: Motorcycle specific oils</TITLE>
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<P><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">Martin,</FONT>
<BR> <FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Arial">Excellent post! I hope this dispels the idea that =
you have to purchase $48 oil for your ride. You will get the same =
effect at $24, if I remember correctly, that you would at $48. =
For those folks who don't like to get ripped off.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">Martin Retherford</FONT>
</P>
<UL><UL>
<P><A NAME=3D"_MailData"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">-----Original =
Message-----</FONT></A>
<BR><B><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">From: mfay@xxxxxxxxxx =
[<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:mfay@xxxxxxxxxx">mailto:mfay@xxxxxxxxxx</A>]</FONT></B>
<BR><B><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">Sent: </FONT></B> <FONT =
SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">Monday, June 21, 1999 5:49 AM</FONT>
<BR><B><FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Arial">To: </FONT></B> <FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Arial">st@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx</FONT>
<BR><B><FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Arial">Subject: </FONT>=
</B> <FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial">Motorcycle specific oils</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> The following =
was posted on the VTR list and I thought you guys might </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> be =
interested.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> =
Martin</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> From: Jeff =
Strickling <jeff@xxxxxxxxxxx> To: </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> =
<superhawk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Sent: =
Tuesday, June 15, 1999 7:47 PM Subject: Motorcycle Specific Oils =
</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> =
(Longish)</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Over the =
past few weeks some of the listers have participated in a </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> discussion =
on the use of Motorcycle Specific oil's VS Automotive Motor </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Oil's and =
Synthetics VS Petroleum based oil's.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Many of you =
have shared your opinion on this subject along with your </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> experiences, =
and I have shared my professional and personal opinions </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> on this =
subject.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Now comes =
the hard part my opinion has been swayed by the testing data </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> my engineers =
and market research staff has compiled.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> As many of =
you know my company manufactures lubricants and we have </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> been =
developing a line of motorcycle lubricants. Today we had a </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> meeting to =
discuss the data we have compiled and what direction we </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> will be =
taking on this product line.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Our =
Petrochemical engineers have done a series of tests on Automotive =
</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> and =
Motorcycle oils that are available to the consumer along with =
</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> testing our =
Automotive oils. Both Petroleum and Synthetic base oils </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> were tested. =
Our testing supported the findings of Dr.John C. Woolum.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> The oils =
tested were all SAE 10W30, 10W40, 15W40 and 20W50 API SJ, </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> SF/SG and =
SG/SH (We can not divulge the brands until the respective </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> companies =
are provided</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> a copy of =
the test results)</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> The first =
set of tests were done in our lab. These tests were Infrared </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Analysis and =
Atomic Absorption. These tests where conducted to </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> alkalize API =
formulations and additive packages.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> The second =
set of test were application tests. We used 5 different </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> motorcycles =
and measured Viscosity, Wear Metals and Load Performance.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> The =
Bikes.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> 1992 =
GSX1100G</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> 1995 =
GL1500</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> 1994 =
F3</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> 1997 =
VTR1000F</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> 1995 Virago =
750</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Automotive =
VS Motorcycle specific (Petroleum and Synthetic)</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> What few =
Automotive oils that we found of the API Services of SF, </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> SF/SG and =
SG/SH they preformed as well and there was no surmountable </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> difference =
to justify the expense of reformulating our current </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> products.(Or =
the personal expense)</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> The =
Automotive oils of SAE 10W30, 10W40, 15W40 and 20W50 API SJ </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> (Energy =
Conserving) did not fare as well. 4 of the 5 motorcycles </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> displayed =
the following problems.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Clutch =
Slippage 10W30, 10W40 and 15W40.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Starter =
Engagement 10W30, 10W40, 15W40 and 20W50</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Conclusion: =
Any API service of SF, SF/SG, SG/SH and non-energy </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> conserving =
SJ will lubricate your motorcycle without any negative </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> =
consequence.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Synthetics =
VS Petroleum.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> I will not =
get into this one in great detail. We did find that </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Synthetics =
are vastly superior to their Petroleum counterparts. The </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Automotive =
Synthetics that we found of the API service of SG worked as </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> well as the =
Motorcycle Specific Oils.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> One note on =
the synthetics, my engineers stated that the Mobil 1 MX4T, </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> V-Twin and =
Bel-Ray EXS had the best additives package and they </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> performed =
the best.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> =
Marketing.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> We polled =
more than 400 Auto parts Stores in 4 major U.S. markets and </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> found that =
less than 4% carried Motorcycle specific oil's and less </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> than 2% =
carried Automotive oils other than SJ energy conserving.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> This is not =
surprising first there are only around 3 million </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> registered =
Motorcycles in the United States VS 25 million plus </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Automobiles =
and Light Duty Trucks.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> The Major =
Oil Companies really only want to market to the largest </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> market =
segment, this also makes sense in regards to manufacturing. So </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> you have a =
smaller market that is demanding what in essence is a </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> specialty =
product. Therefore they can demand a premium price knowing </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> your only =
alternative is the SJ oils on the shelf at the local auto </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> parts =
store.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> When you =
consider the Motorcycling consumer is actually paying more </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> for a lower =
tech product than they do for their car, you can </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> understand =
why they feel they are being ripped off. Now the </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> manufactures =
will try to justify it</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> as supply =
and demand but the reality is these product in their base </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> form </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> are less =
expensive to manufacture.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> At a later =
date I will make available off list or through my web site </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> our</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> test =
data.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> I will also =
keep you all informed on the release date for our </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Motorcycle =
Specific/Automotive Oils. I will tell you they will not be </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> reformulated =
and we are only going change our packaging.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Jeff =
Strickling</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Vice =
President Sales and Marketing.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> The IQA Lube =
Corporation.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> Houston =
Texas.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> * * =
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* *</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> The ST Mailing list is =
sponsored by the Unofficial ST Website</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Arial"> <A =
HREF=3D"http://www.TriumphNet.com/st" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.TriumphNet.com/st</A> for ST and Mailing =
List info</FONT>
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